Dope Tech Episode 2

<<@aucontraire1986 says : You think you can’t make problem solving cool? Watch the movie Interstellar and take notes.>> <<@sergiocastilho2700 says : Did the guest questioned the possibility of left thinking authoritarianism? Really? Did he hear about Soviet Union? Cuba? Venezuela? North Korea? So on and so forth…also, conservative cannot be associated either with disgust or security seeking…this is a try to reduce the most complex and oldest line of thought to a single element. Conservatives are aware they f how difficult it is to build something of value and how easy it is to destroy it and at the same instance values natural rights and liberties individual autonomy and agency, among obviously many other elements. This cannot go along with disgust security seeking at any cost, what has been proven to be an element for f the left during COVID. Look, associating Nazism to conservative thinking or the right is already completely out of way, doesn’t need to much to remember it was England facing them against since the beginning. That was just authoritarianism based on contempt. Disgust and security seeking are marks of authoritarians, what does not go along with conservative and right thinking.>> <<@ALavin-en1kr says : It is interesting how atheists are increasingly borrowing religious terminology such as Enlightenment. It started with the Age of Reason or the so-called Enlightenment after which horrors occurred. Horrors occurred in modern times, not only in the ascent from a Dark Age to the Age of Reason, when the Dark Occult was feared and draconian measures were used to keep it out of the mainstream Horrors happened in The Age of Reason and Enlightenment, all brought about by the Righteous Mind that rivaled anything the Dark Age had come up with. At least then it was the Dark Age so there was some excuse. Steven Pinker is right that things are, and will get better; however, it has nothing to do with rationalism or the righteous mind. It has to do with with Precession of the Equinoxes; the ascent from a Dark Age to a Quantum Age in which human intelligences increases, and even if Consciousness and Mind are not fully understood yet, at least we are getting there.>> <<@sophisticat7673 says : how long will it be befire we classify stupidity as a disblility and impose some positiv discrimination to force employers to hire stupid people..?>> <<@sophisticat7673 says : I love old Stevie P but in this video he seems to have the eyes of a crazed lunatic (forgive the tautology) which i find somewhat distracting...>> <<@wendellbabin6457 says : 16:55 But the wellbeing "THING" DEGENERATES immediately into who decides EXACTLY what that constitutes. When? Who is going to PAY for all this wellbeing? And for WHOM exactly. Who goes first? And who EXACTLY is going to do all of the work to make it REALITY? THE SAME EXACT THINGS THAT ARE CAUSING THE FOMENT WE SEE RIGHT NOW, GENTS. And hasn't stopped since somebody decided it was a "goal". Sorry, not yelling, couldn't find my "Geezer Eyes" and I ain't retyping. That whole "thing" is about as ridiculous as Emojis if you ask me.>> <<@hueyvan2007 says : So much word salad from Jodan Peterson. Somehow I cannot shake the thought that he is an atheist pandering to believing audience for the sake of an audience from which he makes an exceptional living.>> <<@gerrycrabtree3274 says : Haidt not flying the flag after 911 when he wanted to because he didn't want his liberal cohorts to think he may have republican leanings speaks volumes.>> <<@sulljoh1 says : 1:59:26 Jon didn't know about Hitler's table talk? Dawkins "God Delusion" mentioned it - and he attacked that book quite a bit. I guess he never read it???>> <<@joelabraham708 says : the best part is at the end when they say, "oh yeah, by the way, remember that not one thing any of us has ever said or studied or researched can be replicated ... none of it ... even by our own grad students">> <<@burnonedown2day says : This was a very interesting and entertaining talk!>> <<@tenillehafner6471 says : I'm willing it's not about or up to me , WE is the way to take back our life! But I know it al starts right her(pointing at myself)>> <<@andrewbarker8631 says : 🤢>> <<@targoltran says : As a Psychology major, I do agree with Dr. Pinker. Non-random samples do not provide a realistic picture pertaining to behavior research. At least this is my view. I do not agree that the world has become a better place. We have Ukraine and Russian war. In addition, the war between Hamas and Israel. I think both Jordan and Steven are from Canada.>> <<@HerbJon says : Loneliness today is a growing and already catastrophically bad in many ways.>> <<@zaunaura says : Inane Comment Time: Jonathan, Jordan, Steven…hah all their names end in 'n'…>> <<@LeeCarlson says : The issue is that true journalism is about factual reporting where it appears that Dr. Pinker is talking about "sensationalist" journalism. That is a bit like comparing black coffee to some form of barista iced-coffee drink.>> <<@lakshmisharma6182 says : Sad to see no woman is included in discussion,and these people talk about cognitive biases>> <<@marciukspuks5353 says : my god how stupid peterson is. really feel for the two guys having to explain things to him over and over the most basic concepts. zero understanding of skinner, now that is a REAL psychologist!>> <<@gorkmusic says : Steven Pinker is the fucking man, the king of sobering with data and debunking narrative bias.>> <<@kindly4real says : 23:00 The tree in the Garden was not "the tree of knowledge". It was "the tree of the knowledge of good and evil". Judgment is the fruit produced from the knowledge of good and evil. Attachment is the eating part. Forgiveness is spitting the fruit up and grace is leaving it on the Tree, reserving judgment or at least our attachment to it.>> <<@iammisanthrope7764 says : Grapes are poisonous to dogs.>> <<@iammisanthrope7764 says : Its so funny how the three of them are trying so hard to sound intellectual.🤣>> <<@ibelieve3111 says : Hey>> <<@anonygent says : I would say that the God-shaped hole in our psyches, if it's not filled by God or gods, is going to be filled with one of two things: the state as God, or the self as God. I don't think I need to point out that both options lead to terrible outcomes. (I speak of those in the West... China has gone without a God for a long time, so I can't speak to their experience. Although it's interesting that one branch of Buddhism, a fundamentally atheistic religion, turned Buddha into a god.)>> <<@DonnaBrooks says : I'm pausing in the middle to comment: What a great discussion! I learned many things I didn't know from Dr. Pinker & Dr. Haidt had such great insights about our current situation being unique. I said, "Wow!" many times during this video! I will have to listen to this again when I can take NOTES and mark timestamps. Honestly, at this point, IDK whether to feel better or worse about the current state of the our institutions, liberal democracy, and the media. I think Dr. Haidt summed it up well. Dr. Pinker is probably right that we will self-correct, but not in the near future. It might get even worse before it gets better. And I worry about all the damage woke ideology will do until enough people leave that cult & put a stop to it. What an interesting tub-of-war between optimism & pessimism!>> <<@joel9229m says : I’m getting mad, HUME>> <<@joel9229m says : I do not understand why Haidt (who I like a lot) doesn’t talk about David Hume>> <<@autumnleaves2766 says : This is a superb discussion between Dr Peterson, Steven Pinker and Jonathan Haidt from two years ago, glad I went back through the videos to find it. I am very worried by some of the attitudes now. We've just had an incident in London where a British Asian shopkeeper violently restrained a black woman who was apparently trying to steal from the shop, or so it is claimed. In the hierarchy of victimhood, it appears that the black woman trumps the Asian shopkeeper. He has had to go into hiding and some horrible notes have been plastered on his shop front. One reads, chillingly: "no place for parasitical merchants here". This has overtones of Maoist China, North Korea, Stalinist Russian, Khmer Rouge Cambodia. No one has tried to see it from the shopkeeper's point of view. He admits he was too forceful, but equally he has the right to prevent theft from his shop. A few weeks earlier in another part of London, pro Chinese Communist party slogans were spray painted on a wall in Chinese, soon to be defaced by others and then removed. In my home town in the north, two Communist party recruitment posters appeared, plastered on empty shop premises. Karl Marx was depicted in the pose of Kitchener in the famous WW1 recruitment posters. In seventeen years of living here, this is only the second time I have seen a political poster or message put up or spray painted on a wall. It has been noticed by others and the posters have been removed. I do not like the idea that we might have a Communist cell round here, and the reaction to the incident in the shop in London indicates that these belief systems, which have led to the deaths of well over 100 million people in the 20th century, are now widespread amongst certain sections of the community. It is very worrying. I also don't understand the 1960s protesters who wanted to tear everything down. They had no idea about what to put forward in place of the old systems and most of the people in the protests came from affluent or middle class backgrounds, "bloody French intellectuals" as Dr Peterson calls them. China would love to spread its brand of Communism in the west, with social credit scores and constant tracking and monitoring of individuals. I really worry about the 45 years old and under age group, many of whom have not been well educated and do not know their 20th century history. I limit my social media usage just to a little time on FB, with long periods where I don't go on there at all. I think parents have to be tougher with their kids about this. Thanks so much gentlemen for this great discussion.>> <<@jm5386 says : …. Bla bla. …. Because it’s expressed in all kinds of ways because it can’t be articulated???? Wait….Give JP a moment, here it comes - surely he’s gonna find a way to articulate his version it into your consciousness. The jibberish, MY Lord. Ps…the definition of sin is this, not that. (Word Salade with a mound of bacon bits). He really is a mystical wonderland. The biblical definition of sin is found in 1 John 3:4: “Sin is the transgression of the law” (King James Version). To sin is to transgress, or break, the law of God.>> <<@unicornthinker7262 says : I really think that while somewhat true, what is being left out of the conversation is the love of money and its motivation.>> <<@larrysparks7588 says : Jordan I have been watching members of society dividing and as I watch. I can't help be stuck with awareness that I am watching a living example of franklin reality model. That what I see is every one defending their belief window [professor haidt would say the elephant driver]. As I learned to apply this principal the most important point was to review your results and if they are not what you want, look at your window to see what belief is causing it>> <<@Dustysoapbox says : Pinker is slipping. No one is capable of unbiased observation. Novel but no.>> <<@matthewross3828 says : Peterson helping Pinker recall his point at 1:03 was a nice moment>> <<@bobbeckel5266 says : I cannot help but wonder if Steven Pinker's observation that things are getting better is driven by our persistent focus on problems.>> <<@eduardofranz says : Jonathan Haidt| Religions that made it to America. a Free country? Yes for white people. I am free so everybody is free and I am happy to think that way.>> <<@eduardofranz says : Progressive hate progress. Really? Is Pinker a Sophist? Not impressed>> <<@Sergiuss555 says : Half way through and jordan keeps recruiting people into his club of religion apologists.>> <<@pakerdoguozdemir2749 says : 🎯 Key Takeaways for quick navigation: 00:04 📰 Discusses the drawbacks of basing our world view on journalism, which often showcases the worst incidents. 01:13 🌱 Emphasizes that recognizing past progress can inspire continued efforts for improvement in the future. 01:57 📚 Introduction of Dr. Steven Pinker, detailing his achievements, accolades, and academic background. 02:54 📘 Brief overview of Dr. Jonathan Haidt's career, achievements, and upcoming book releases. 04:18 🤝 Jordan Peterson mentions his admiration for Haidt's research on disgust and moral sentiments. 05:44 ⚖️ Haidt defines "moralism" and warns against interpreting issues in terms of good vs. evil, as it can cloud judgment. 09:43 🧠 The news often showcases the worst events, creating an "availability heuristic" which distorts our perception of risk and danger. 11:36 🌆 Utopian concepts can be dangerous as they often result in the elimination of those who disagree to achieve an ideal world. 14:06 🌍 The existence of universal archetypes, like notions of purity and pollution, is possibly tied to our evolutionary past. 18:49 ⛔ Believing that those who oppose your utopian vision are barriers to a perfect world can lead to extreme and harmful measures against them. 19:16 🤝 While liberal democracy is important, it doesn't resonate with people as deeply as religious beliefs do. 21:35 💭 The challenge is making the idea of "human well-being" inspiring; it might need to be personified or not remain an abstract concept to resonate. 27:24 📚 Great literature complicates narratives, showing divisions within sides and halting quick judgments; humility is a virtue in some religious beliefs, notably Christianity. 28:20 📖 Emphasizing the virtues of humility, grace, and forgiveness which have been lost in modern society. 31:20 💡 The shared pursuit of an ideal, rather than just beliefs, has the power to unite people. 36:14 🔄 Piaget's lesser-known "messianic stage" in cognitive development represents a world-changing fervor during adolescence. 38:05 🧠 The question arises on engaging people without the reliance on religious or pseudo-religious practices, focusing instead on a problem-solving approach. 39:25 📱 The assertion that societal dynamics drastically changed after 2012, pointing towards the profound influence of social media. 40:08 🌐 The evolution of activist movements, noting how they previously involved multiple generations but now can rapidly mobilize, often without input from experienced adults. 41:04 🚫 The 2010s observed an increase in intolerance, with many individuals feeling silenced by a dominating subset of outspoken peers. 46:32 🌀 Algorithms on platforms not only dictate content consumption but also influence personal connections, leading to potential factionalism. 47:14 🏫 The value of diverse social interactions in public schools, which demand behavior adaptation, contrasts the tailored online experiences. 47:28 🌍 Concern about people losing touch with the broader culture due to online echo chambers. 48:41 ⏳ The modern digital era might limit the younger generation's knowledge of historical events and great literature. 50:19 🔄 The media landscape has shifted from centripetal (unifying) to more fragmented. 51:00 📉 While some societal indicators have declined, global metrics like poverty and war have improved. 52:38 📊 Current backsliding in democracies doesn't equate to the political state of the 1970s. 55:38 🔙 Comparing current times with the 1970s reveals current concerns might be overblown. 56:48 📰 Concerns about the reliability and objectivity of The New York Times and some social sciences. 58:10 🌐 The dangers of society becoming factionalized with each group having its own version of truth, due to technology and the decline of central, trusted institutions. 01:00:44 💉 The erosion of trust in health establishments due to perceived double standards, and its impact on public health, such as vaccine skepticism. 01:01:28 🚫 The dangers of stifling discourse by labeling discussions on potential origins of viruses like SARS-CoV-2 as "racist." 01:01:55 📜 Historical biases and misreporting by major news outlets, including the New York Times' handling of significant world events. 01:03:48 🖥️ The observation that new communication mediums tend to start with a period of misinformation before norms and fact-checking mechanisms are established. 01:06:20 🔄 Wikipedia harnesses viewpoint diversity to improve its content. 01:06:47 🔄 The rapid pace of technological change may outstrip our ability to develop corrective mechanisms. 01:10:06 🐝 Humans have a unique ability to immerse themselves in a group, similar to how a bee is part of a hive. 01:11:56 🇺🇸 The tribal urge to display symbols, like the American flag after 9/11, indicates deep-rooted group affiliations. 01:12:52 ✝️ Humans have evolved with a deep sense of spirituality, gravitating towards tribal gods rather than global deities. 01:13:46 🔗 Religious beliefs often serve to bind communities together, even if they don't necessarily track reality. 01:14:15 🌐 Both Durkheim and Darwin can be integrated in understanding the concept of multi-level selection related to religion and sacredness. 01:15:13 ⛩️ There's a connection between what's sacred and what inspires awe. 01:15:27 🕊️ A debate emerges on whether the instinct for awe is the same as the instinct for imitation. 01:15:56 ⚽ People can experience collective awe in scenarios like witnessing a great athletic feat in a stadium. 01:18:13 🌀 Emile Durkheim's perspective: Collective experiences at sports events resemble the feeling of merging into something larger, entering the realm of the sacred. 01:19:10 🤝 Imitation is a crucial human ability for learning, especially when it comes to cultural evolution. 01:20:36 🕊️ Religious rituals involve imitative actions that can bring about a sense of oneness or "atonement". 01:24:14 🌍 Discussing the emergence of monotheism from local tribal religions and their hierarchical arrangements over time. 01:29:35 🎵 The idea that people unite around transcendent experiences, such as music, due to their imitative capacities. 01:30:46 🤝 Emphasizing the different aspects of religious experience from both a social and clinical psychological standpoint. 01:31:55 🗣️ Communication relies on shared presuppositions, cultural background, and language. 01:33:06 🤝 The natural human capacity to unite in team modes and suppress individual biases when facing common challenges. 01:33:21 🤝 Teams can be viewed as having a collective personality, where each member represents a fragment of the team's whole. 01:33:53 💭 Discussing the ambiguous nature of "personality" - an animating spirit or pattern that might be shared among people. 01:34:21 ⚖️ Debating whether the central principle of Western culture is power, and considering other potential central principles like sexuality, money, or self-esteem. 01:35:16 🔌 Highlighting the overemphasis on power structures and their influence on perception and behavior. 01:37:35 💡 Noting the challenge of the "woke" movement's critique of reason and Enlightenment thinking. 01:38:31 🌐 Describing how social media has blurred domain boundaries, making reasoned discussions challenging. 01:41:34 🌍 Stressing human's innate social nature and the profound impact of well-constituted groups on happiness. 01:42:02 🎯 Highlighting the significance of shared goals or ideals in uniting groups and giving purpose. 01:44:07 🤝 Shared experiences in crises, not necessarily shared beliefs, bond individuals. 01:44:48 ⛑️ Real-life challenges and mutual aid foster closeness; like children navigating scrapes or soldiers confronting race issues. 01:45:55 🚫 Shared crisis moments reveal who's important by demonstrating self-sacrificing behavior. 01:49:39 🐶 Other animals, like dogs, might exhibit signs of disgust, but it's controversial. 01:50:34 🐒 Chimps exhibit a form of "contagion" behavior, as demonstrated by a chimp using a dead rat to elicit reactions from others. 01:51:14 😅 Recollection of a college prank mirrors the chimps' behavior, questioning the unique human emotion of disgust. 01:52:25 🧠 Disgust might have its roots in evolutionary biology and may be prevalent in species closely related to humans. 01:53:10 🔄 A link exists between political views and personalities; those leaning conservative may be more disgust sensitive. 01:54:06 🌍 The Brexit debate reflects a broader global issue of open vs. closed borders, influencing political ideologies. 01:55:14 🔐 The term "securitarian" describes those focused on security, which can influence political affiliations. 01:56:12 🏙️ New York City's crime wave re-emergence sparks concerns over security, influencing mayoral election sentiments. 01:59:34 📜 A significant portion of Hitler's correspondence is centered around the theme of disgust. 02:00:16 😷 Disgust drives people not only to avoid but to destroy the source of their revulsion, as evidenced by the Nazis' affinity for the symbolism of fire. 02:00:45 🧠 Openness to experience, negatively correlated with disgust, is a significant trait influencing political leanings. 02:01:12 🌀 The relationship between negative emotions and political inclinations might not be straightforward, as they don't always clump together. 02:01:27 🎨 While Hitler had a keen interest in aesthetics and architecture, he was particular about what he deemed acceptable, showcasing his selective openness and strong preference for orderliness. Made with HARPA AI>> <<@shaunashton5434 says : I remember during one of my late 90s UK Uni courses the phrase "Personal Truth" - me I prefer facts, history, and trans-national comparisons. I have always found more in common with my fellow humans than I've found different. But I'm no nihilist. There's some kind of inherent bias we all have about not letting go of a belief we make - regardless of information to the contrary.>> <<@EMCforYOU says : Also an enemy>> <<@EMCforYOU says : Need to create a sense of special…saved…these are the draws in religion gods>> <<@doover1467 says : wish you guys would define your terms. btw when the money runs out you will get your utopia.>> <<@jonathangilmore3193 says : The battle within, to borrow from Dr. Peterson, a further psychologization of the non-religious meaning inherent in “within” is maturity, a very long developmental process, necessitating supportive and encouraging family and initial sub-cultural ion, presumptively after “the good family!” Deep empathy, love, not public persona, a love, which is not ego-driven, but can say to your significant other: “you can die first, and I’ll be OK!” Well, you won’t be OK if you aren’t as deeply emotionally resilient or hardy! How many of us are. How many of us turn our critical lens on ourselves, rather than on the other tribe? First thing you learn in the crucible of marriage is you can’t change her! You can get your act together, but you cannot change their act! No way! We used to know back in the ‘60s that the personal is the political. We seem to not be much into history, or reading books, or asking ourselves questions like how Shakespeare was able to keep his head when so many of Elizabeth’s enemies politicized Richard II? Pogo knew: “I have seen the enemy, and it is us!”>> <<@Morewecanthink says : 'Enlightenment': the arbitrary decision to close your mind for the revelation of its Creator. From where within the natural materialistic atheistic Worldview wants someone derive meaning and relation to truth of his arbitrary results of the random chemical processes of grey mass in his head?>> <<@hippiecritegymnastics3311 says : Shift from Theory to the Truth of Human Motivations and varying World Views David R Hawkin's Map of Consciousness and how to experience exploration of it on Audible, Amazon, most bookstores. "Letting Go" Example 1: From the Ego, one will think Post-Modernism is True. Example 2: Integrity leads to more manifest truth. Example 3: Concept "Love your enemy" Proofs of Concept: The Marshall Plan and MLK Jr's "I have a dream" speech. The power to change the world lies in the truth which reason is deduced from. Example 4: The words of those who operated ~ 750 to 1000 are the figures associated with the founding of the religions whose words still affect people.>> <<@kobiianardo says : 45:00 haaahha xD cute>> <<@motiveinmotivation383 says : Another vote for Thomas sowell>> <<@grahamyoung249 says : Struggling with what Jordan means about "imitation" and how it differs from being "in the spirit". I sing in a choir, and I don't feel that I'm imitating anyone, I'm trying to translate the notes into music that people will appreciate. This is a shared endeavour, and for reasons of physics and the way sound waves interact, the timbre of each singer needs to be similar or, even though each is singing in tune, the whole will be out of tune. So I try to imitate the sound of the person next to me to some extent, as they try to imitate my sound to some extent, but this is really a negotiation that takes place across the whole choir and isn't ultimately imitation - it's almost a conversation. (In fact I have done choral exercises where the choirs sound will move from one note to another and resolve on the new note without anyone directing it in particular, so it's almost like we're not so much imitating, but trying to arrive at the same point). Similarly I don't feel that I conform to the rhythm. Rhythm isn't strict, it is slightly malleable, and that's the difference between someone just playing or singing the notes and someone making music. Again, there is a negotiation in the best choirs, as to how the rhythm will be incorporated, or even interpreted, which also involve the choir master and the accompanist. But wouldn't this be more correctly described as being "in the spirit" rather than imitation? If you just sing the notes without expression, it is dead. With expression and nuance it is alive and full of spirit. Bach claimed that music was a sacrament, and in the sense that Jordan sees religion as an attempt to reach the highest and the best, isn't that what is happening with a choir? At least the ideal choir.>> <<@chiltondaniel says : What a wonderful debate. An example of how other views can be discussed, and how doing so helps us understand even more.>>