Dope Tech Episode 2

<<@IsraelJacob81 says : This guy is gay through and through lol>> <<@mccalltrader says : Who would let this degen take the moral high ground..what lunacy>> <<@matthewstump7563 says : Why? Because they were never believers to begin with. If they truly had the Holy Spirit within them they would never question their Faith. Remember when Paul would lay hands on those who were baptized by Peter and other disciples. Paul knew they weren't filled with the Holy Spirit and weren't true believers. That's the difference with Jon, being a cultural Christian compared to a Spirit filled Christian. When it comes to morals. Bill Clinton told Milosevic that it was immoral to kill Bosnians. Milosevic said, "your morals or mine">> <<@Believe_the_Bible says : Christian leader? No such thing. Gal 3:28 KJV There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are>> <<@markeyaw434 says : I marvel at how Jon is not being mean or arrogant here. Pray for this guy that God draws Him back and gives Him a revelation of things He did not understand before he decided to walk away from the faith. God loves Him so much.>> <<@jamesemerson4102 says : He says it's "good" for you to not be murdered, but if there is no objective morality, all you can say is that we have a drive to survive, and not being murdered would enable us to survive, but why is that good or bad, morally? it will mean we will go on living. We get what we desire because we keep on living, but this is different to moral good and evil. Is receiving what you desire what moral "good" is? We live contrary to this all of the time. We do what we think is "right" even if we have to die for it, sometimes. Morals go deeper than even death and sacrifice. There is clearly something much deeper happening. With this type of individualistic morality, laws and ethics would basically come down to what each individual wants and that would then naturally flow to what the majority want, which is a major problem that we've seen happen in history. How else can we make laws based on individual desires and needs other than what the majority of the individuals desire? If majority thinks it's good to kill a certain race, does that make it good? no. It just means they get to do what they want. The "what's good for ME" type of morality is not only potentially catastrophic but I'd say that it lies at the root of evil. Basically that "Good" is what I as an individual desire, as long as a bunch of other people desire the same thing, then It's justified. I find this to be absolutely absurd. I refuse to believe that if for example 80% of the world thought it was the right way forward to kill off children, or a certain race, that this is therefore "good." Morality doesn't exist at this point. It's just raw human desire and self satisfaction.>> <<@redfaux74 says : Jon is just avoiding the real issue. He's talking in circles and refusing to talk about his real obvious problem. He's gay. He has children. He's torn. He doesn't want to be confronted just yet. He cannot come into the light with it just yet. It'll take some time. His kind is always subverted because they cater to feelings. He cannot condemn his friends because he's a Liberal and cannot separate from the world. And then, somewhere, he crossed that line and liked it. He cannot accept the truth of the inerrant Word of God. Until he's ready he'll just talk in weak circles and he knows it. Gospel light churches produce this kind of thing and they are growing exponentially. It's sad. No preaching on sin produces luke warm believers. Hot preaching drives the rebellious away. Giving your flock cotton candy weekly keeps the rebellious in the pew. A hot Bible will draw you closer to God or drive you away.>> <<@brantgentry1463 says : If what I feel or my experience doesn't match reality then feelings and experience are irrelevant. I don't always feel God's presence, but that doesn't mean he isn't always there>> <<@the_great_satan says : I'm proud of Jon. He is so eloquent and gentle when voicing his objections to Christianity.>> <<@sre1236 says : I think stoning someone to death is wrong I wouldn’t take my child up a mount anti kill him like Abraham did either so ya it’s not as easy as u think to just be religious>> <<@steveprofiler says : Would it be better to press a RED button to blow the whole world so no life can suffer anymore?>> <<@metorphoric says : There are some many questions I have for Jon. 2 that really resonates with me are: He is married, did his wife lose faith as well and if so, what was her reasoning? Did they come to the same reasoning? Did she challenge him on losing the faith? Does he feel a sense of guilt or responsibility to those who found God through his music that may now feel a since of betrayal and question his authenticity? What would he say to these people?>> <<@1206chaos says : I spent more time in the comment section on this one.>> <<@litigioussociety4249 says : Ethics and Morality aren't the same thing in most modern usage. Ethics refers to what infringes upon a person's rights, and those rights are established through some objective means of philosophy, usually first principles. Morality on the other hand deals with what an individual believes is wrong in a situation, and all other things are moral or amoral. Religious people believe in a morality based on some foundatinal doctrine. Non-religous people may have a doctrine, but outside of that they have nothing objective. If the atheist guy here said he based his morality on the laws of America, then his religion is essentially American federalism, which does seem to be the case for a lot of people, even Christians, putting the government above God.>> <<@jkm9332 says : Behold the intellectual bankruptcy of atheism.>> <<@heis3112 says : 2 Timothy 2:24-26 24 And a servant of the Lord must not quarrel but be gentle to all, able to teach, patient, 25 in humility correcting those who are in opposition, if God perhaps will grant them repentance, so that they may know the truth, 26 and that they may come to their senses and escape the snare of the devil, having been taken captive by him to do his will. Jon can't repent unless God grants it to him.>> <<@correctchristian4255 says : Some Disciples and an Apostle denied Jesus. That a "Christian musician" did the same should invoke a yawn.>> <<@Hvb101 says : This man, seems like a real good person>> <<@natf5869 says : Sorry but you don't lose your faith in Christ, you never really had it in the first place. Many will say Lord, but He will say I never knew you.>> <<@pills4bill says : Frank there's no way to discern objectively the moral persuasion of self defense. When exactly has the accused exhibited excessive force?>> <<@SojournerDidimus says : The switcheroo is strong with this one. Bottom line, he presupposes that objective morality doesn't exist. He just doesn't have proof for it.>> <<@kelslo74 says : Moralism gets ya nowhere>> <<@Hunterkohl1 says : God Bless You all. All Glory Honor Praise Worship and Thanksgiving to God. Jesus is King!!! Thank You God for just who you are and everything Thank You Jesus for everything thank You Holy Spirit for everything we love You God with absolutely everything with all our heart soul mind and strength>> <<@cosmiccruxbot3841 says : What makes a "Christian" want to leave Christ? What makes life different for those who reject Christianity?>> <<@ready1fire1aim1 says : [Leibniz's contingency argument for God, clarified]: Ten whole, rational numbers 0-9 and their geometric counterparts 0D-9D. 0 and it's geometric counterpart 0D are: 1) whole 2) rational 3) not-natural 4) necessary 1-9 and their geometric counterparts 1D-9D are: 1) whole 2) rational 3) natural 4) contingent Newton says since 0 and 0D are "not-natural" ✅ then they are also "not-necessary" 🚫. Newton also says since 1-9 and 1D-9D are "natural" ✅ then they are also "necessary" 🚫. This is called "conflating" and is repeated throughout Newton's Calculus/Physics/Geometry/Logic. con·flate verb combine (two or more texts, ideas, etc.) into one. Leibniz does not make these fundamental mistakes. Leibniz's "Monadology" 📚 is zero and it's geometric counterpart zero-dimensional space. 0D Monad (SNF) 1D Line (WNF) 2D Plane (EMF) 3D Volume (GF) We should all be learning Leibniz's Calculus/Physics/Geometry/Logic. Fibonacci sequence starts with 0 for a reason. The Fibonacci triangle is 0, 1, 2 (Not 1, 2, 3). Newton's 1D-4D "natural ✅ = necessary 🚫" universe is a contradiction. Natural does not mean necessary. Similar, yet different. Not-natural just means no spatial extension; zero size; exact location only. Necessary. Newtonian nonsense will never provide a Theory of Everything. Leibniz's Law of Sufficient Reason should be required reading 📚.>> <<@achristian11 says : I think that Jon is not open to being wrong, he always looks at a way out of every corner he is put on with "maybe" it means something else.>> <<@carlosrosario9485 says : Sin here is crouching at the door.>> <<@ExodusPrime-x5h says : When I was an atheist, I agreed with the idea of well being being to standard. However one of my many flaws in this thinking was my idea of this was different to everyone else's. I found I was applying an across the board standard to my own and everyone else's actions which led to baseless judgement. Even everyday things such as parenting, marriage and positive behaviour and my understandings of these things were only the result of my environment and the impact of others throughout my life. Facing this with honestly led me to a very dark place, ultimately without objective truth then everything is subjectively true. I had no argument against evil beyond a difference of opinion, as without an objective moral standard that is outside of my experience then I cannot define what evil is and I don't have a right to. My personal view of evil may be another's good. So in my desperation I turned to Jesus, because I remembered a friend who read and applied to Bible to his life, he was living a consistently peaceful, joyous and abundant life, I wanted that too. In the days following my repentance and faith in Jesus I experienced changes in my self that I couldn't explain. I came to believe in the Bible as the truth and Jesus as saviour per the gospel. When I look back I now see a completely different person before I came to Jesus. Where at one time I was just trying my best with the things in my life, now I allow for the Bible to speak to tell me how to love and live. One of the many reasons why I believe this to be the truth is because just by living it I've gotten all sorts of insults and hatred for believing, however when they're asked what reason they have, not one person brings anything of substance and their disapproval is just baseless dislike, most of the time due to negative bias>> <<@chrismillard5172 says : I wish him the best.... I think nearly all of us look to God.... Sometimes some of us walk away but if you're his, well, you're his.... and the Father will run to meet the son while he's still a long way off when he realises how hungry his spirit is and remembers what it was like at his Fathers house.>> <<@jesuschristdestroysmarxism3916 says : First of all there's no such thing as former Christian let's get that straight if you were never in the faith and you were never you never had a personal relationship with Jesus Christ you never were a Christian the Bible says they went out from us because they never belonged to us""""" when you are a born again believer you're a true Born Again believer you get converted by God God does the conversion and you never stop trusting Christ when you have a relationship with him you may have your doubts but you always trust him>> <<@SliderFury1 says : A lot of people in these comment replies seem to believe that God, who created us and is perfect, should be beholden to the same set of rules and standards that He holds us, His imperfect creations, to. Purporting that God should be or behave a certain way according to how we subjectively determine morality (in our own minds, apart from His) is like the Earth telling the Sun what temperature it should burn at. Our experience of existence is completely different from His, so we need a completely different set of rules in order to function well within it. That's not hypocrisy, it's very specific guidance and instruction that we often choose to ignore. And therein lies the ultimate conundrum. Choice. If there were irrefutable and indisputable evidence of God's existence, it would be a difficult argument to make that you still had a choice to not believe in Him. There is irrefutable and indisputable evidence of gravity. Does anyone here feel like they have a choice not to believe it exists? Perhaps you still have a choice but no one chooses it. Everyone believes gravity exists BECAUSE of the evidence. However, believing in gravity doesn't cause you to behave or treat your fellow humans in a certain way. Loving (not not loving) them does. So just like God forcing you to love Him would make that love not real, He's not going to force you to believe in Him by proving his existence like gravity. Then you'd just believe because He made you. You would love Him because He told you to and it makes no logical sense not to. He doesn't want that. He wants you to choose Him. Not inspite of how difficult this mortal existence can be, but because of it.>> <<@samuelflores1419 says : Just be honest you want to be your own God! You want to do your own thing! I will Never understand having had God in your life and the indwelling of the Holy spirit how can anyone go to the other side. But then maybe they Never had God and the Holy Spirit in the first place! God bless!>> <<@heyitsal7474 says : In my many years on this earth I've found the more words a person uses to explain their position the less position they really have>> <<@davidromero2705 says : The arguments for morality absent divine authority never balance. The question is always, but why?>> <<@170221dn says : If god commanded someone to kill babies would Christians say it was morally acceptable to kill babies?>> <<@bootneylee9802 says : Good conversation. I don't understand why this guy lost his faith. He seems reasonable enough to see the truth. The devil can be very clever and persuasive through rhetoric and "philosophy" to convince you to play God. He's been at it a looooooong time. 🤷‍♂️>> <<@KeepsLearning says : I don't think Jon really understands the difference between objective and subjective>> <<@DavidKfilmmaker says : They went out from us because they were not of us>> <<@arniekando6846 says : So Jon never came before the Lord in prayer and humbled himself and experienced the Holy Spirit ? Without faith its impossible to please God....>> <<@lungaskosana7546 says : This morality question is the one question I have never heard atheism deal with...>> <<@Makai77 says : This man needs prayer for sure. It's easy to see he's not at peace. He's confused- he wasn't ever truly saved and born again. God Bless Frank for having grace and compassion for this lost soul. I pray he has a real conversion.>> <<@neildalessandro8196 says : It's interesting that Jon mentions Sam Harris' emphasis on wellbeing because no matter how you slice it, salvation in Christianity cannot be adequately understood apart from that. It's because salvation in the Bible doesn't just refer to right standing with God, but it involves removing all impediments to human flourishing. It means deliverance from captivity and enslavement, healing diseases and wounds, breaking addictions, repairing relationships, and so much more. We are called to worship God as what we are created for, but how does one worship God? By being human and partaking in activities that are part of being human. If Christians took on this understanding of what salvation in the Bible is really all about, then they would be a lot more effective in carrying out their mission and doing God's will.>> <<@Whatsisface4 says : How do you get from no ultimate purpose to, therefore no purpose? Our very nature gives our lives meaning and purpose, just not ultimate meaning and purpose.>> <<@keithadams5190 says : Sounds like he is trying to fit his ideas into a bubble that doesn't need God, even though no matter how he tries to "spin" it he can't get away from truth....no matter how hard he tries>> <<@TroyVershawnProductions says : Dear Apologists: Frank is putting on a clinic here. He allows his opponent to talk allowing them to dig themselves deeper and deeper. Then he uses all of his opponents statements against them. Too many of us love the art of argument so much, that we think the more we cut off or saying more words will overcome our opponents’ argument. Not true. In Acts, Paul went to Mars Hill, and let all the philosophers talk, and when he was given the floor, he flipped their theological perspective on its head. Be patient my dear apologists. Our time to speak will come. And God will give us the words to speak.>> <<@chimp09 says : Never understood why this discussion is always so much about objective and subjective..... I really don't care. If you want to explain why we have morality, evolution is enough to do that. If you want as justification, evolution can't give one, but again: I really don't care (and why would anybody even need a justification?)>> <<@Blessed.2.Teach.4God says : You did great here Frank (as usual) ...you handled him just fine but one point you might could've added is... WHY do so many people even hold that "subjective" view....... because it's innately built in from the objective Creator!>> <<@kellybrown6988 says : “They went out from us, for they were not of us, for if they had been of us , they would have no doubt continued with us, but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.” -verse written by the apostle John>> <<@simoneceron1915 says : Morality has always been subjective and implying the existence of God, just make morality subjective to that God. Moreover Cristian morality is so ephemeral that 2000 years ago didn't even existe. So why someone should care what God said when personal experiences are a practical guideline?>> <<@1GodOnly says : If I remember correctly Frank subscribes to OSAS, so it shouldn’t really matter where this guy is spiritually. If he was a Christian once God to make him go to heaven now right?>>