Jon Steingard, the former lead singer of the Christian rock group Hawk Nelson, says that he's no longer a Christian. In this video, he and Frank discuss whether or not we can trust our own thinking in the absence of God. Check it out!
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#StealingFromGod #EvidenceForGod
Due to a problem in the live recording Lewis' quote was left incomplete, but this is the complete quote:
“Supposing there was no intelligence behind the universe, no creative mind. In that case, nobody designed my brain for the purpose of thinking. It is merely that when the atoms inside my skull happen, for physical or chemical reasons, to arrange themselves in a certain way, this gives me, as a by-product, the sensation I call thought. But, if so, how can I trust my own thinking to be true? It's like upsetting a milk jug and hoping that the way it splashes itself will give you a map of London. But if I can't trust my own thinking, of course I can't trust the arguments leading to Atheism, and therefore have no reason to be an Atheist, or anything else. Unless I believe in God, I cannot believe in thought: so I can never use thought to disbelieve in God.”
@dperkins01 Says:
Babbling babbling frank turek and c s lewis. But you use your own thinking to doubt your own thinking, lol. We can play that game.
@SojournerDidimus Says:
Postmodernism, again. I feel like I think the right thing, so therefore my thinking is right.
@Scolecite Says:
Why would you trust your own thinking anyways. You are just one person in the world. The scientific method is how we arrive at truth.
@monkkeygawd Says:
That CS Lewis quote/thought is upside-down... dualism (Christianity's world view) is false... the Universe is Nondual... our "minds" are merely dissociated perspectives of "god/The One Mind of Existence. Please read Dr. Bernardo Kastrup's " Why Materialism is Bologna" for a deep dive into proof for nondualism. I'm an Idealist, therefore Consciousness is primal and material/matter has NO stand alone existence. All is Mind Stuff. We are basically the dream avatars of "God."
@rifano Says:
There’s no such thing as “loosing faith”. If the faith is true and saving faith in Jesus, then there’s no such thing as loosing your faith.
@Caewrld Says:
Hey can you pls respond to this comment or make a video ab it. Idk if certain games n sports like GTA Fortnite boxing Minecraft football call of duty MMA or Minecraft are wrong to play or not
@BabbleCacophony Says:
For one, this argument can only say whether or not your beliefs reasonably lead to being able to trust your senses and reasoning. In other words, it's asking if you have a consistent world view. It can't lead to any sort of truth that entails the existence of a God. Frank is right to say that evolutionary fitness is not enough to create confidence in our own senses and reasoning. It seems that those things should contribute to fitness but it doesn't necessarily do so. The naturalist just needs to believe that their senses and reasoning need to be reliable in order to survive and function. This should be a satisfactory answer unless Frank meant it in a solipsistic way. In that case, no one can escape that, not even Frank. Just because an intelligent creator created you, doesn't mean that they created you in a way that allowed you to sense the world and logically understand it. Even with a God, you could still be a creature with the faculties of a shrimp and not even know it. I find it frustrating when Christians think scolipsism is not a problem for them and so they decide to use it against others.
@CDGMR1 Says:
Great video
@RangerRyke Says:
I’m alive. I see bad thinking get people killed, therefore my thinking can be trusted in so far that it keeps me alive.
@ChiefCedricJohnson Says:
John 10:27
My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
@InfoArtistJKatTheGoodInfoCafe Says:
At least the guest admits that he is very wrong about what he thinks he knows.
@nicholasemond1388 Says:
No Frank, you do not need to know what is true to know you were or are incorrect.
@sidwhiting665 Says:
It goes back to Descarte... "I think; therefore, I am." Absolute truth is grounded in this statement.
.
The Atheist cannot say that. At best, a true atheist can say, "I think I think; therefore, I may be." Subjective "my truth" is grounded in this statement.
@dannylinc6247 Says:
DNA evidence shows a point where humans became a non user of some of what their strands contain. they still contain those things. it's like an unseen designer made a change or rewrote for their code to exclude it.
the outermost layer in all living carbon based life has been found to contain "God eternal within the body" as it has been decoded.
those scientists and their finding is also remarkably found in the Safir Ytzera.
I learned this from the explanation put forth by Greg Braden, when he learned of it.
God made you and me, and seems to have told us, within us.
@Steven-ki9sk Says:
So Turek says "... but if your mind was put together by an intellgence then you have reason to believe in certain things...and that is best explained by god. "
He is saying if you believe a wizard made your brain, that is somehow justification that the wizard is real. How is this not circular reasoning / delusional? Please someone explain this to me?
@MapleBar777 Says:
If you BELIEVE objective thought exists you must also believe an objective mind exists which must be beyond human subjectivity and therefore existence. If you don't, you can't BELIEVE anything. Measurements cannot exist without objective units.
@kevinwesterville2115 Says:
We are all dumber now
@tTtt-ho3tq Says:
I can't trust my own thinking to be true.
@SprintingSpartan Says:
1:13 what's there to be confused about?
@jackjones3657 Says:
There are many things God has chosen to keep hidden from us, perhaps because we would not understand the full revelation at this point, to protect us or simply because He's sovereign and chose to. Either way He has given more than enough general revelation in His creation to give us undeniable hope in the veracity of His Word.
@simplyseculardave Says:
If the Level of Evidence & Method Used to establish a deity belief can be tested and demonstrated to bring you to false conclusions, is it really the method that you should be using? If you believe in a thing, challenge that belief. The truth survives honest, rigorous scrutiny. That which is not demonstrably true, Does Not.
@notw8769 Says:
Jesus loves me more than I know He is my everything always has and always will, and will no long bow down to this world. Jesus will save you and set you free if you are truly repentant and trust the Holy Spirit in your life.
@cristianandrade3710 Says:
I feel like he is trying so hard to believe that God is not real...
@billbrock8547 Says:
" . . . a lot of people are very wrong about what they know." For example: Christians, including the ones who quote C.S. Lewis.
@waxworse Says:
Did he ever use faith alone and believe in the death, burial, and resurrection for salvation?
Some people are/were just claiming Christianity, but were never truly saved. Like Bart Errman for example.
@jenniferwalsh1731 Says:
When you start to KNOW God, you can't unknow Him. He's too amazing and well, there's no words for Him, we are privileged to have the option to worship Him! If you truly know Him, you will always seek Him more and more. Always.
@patrickr9642 Says:
I wonder why they're so much animosity between everyone. Both sides state they have truth. Seems to be a never ending battle
@warrengoss7547 Says:
The "blonde", tattooed guy (?) obviously has no idea about what he's talking about.
@teddyrascal6305 Says:
But I think, he said. Lol
@mark48125 Says:
I know Jesus Christ changed my life and no one can ever take that away from me.
@michaelrunk5930 Says:
I'm sorry what Frank said about thought and reason is most unintelligent rambling I've ever heard for the existence of God.
You don't need to have a creator to have thought and reason. You don't need a creator to look and observe the world or the universe around you.
He just rambling just to ramble.
@dodibenabba1378 Says:
There is NO SUCH THING as an ex Christian. If you're born again then you are NEVER going back! You're a New Creation! These "Christian" musicians who fall away are deliberately planted by the satanic agenda in order to lead their followers away.
@rockzalt Says:
There's a rather interesting story about an event that has both proof and persuasion in it at the same time. When the apostle Paul was proclaiming the gospel in front of proconsul Sergius Paulus. That's when Paul's apologetic faced off with Elymas the magician's and ultimately the proof was in the persuasion. Acts 13: 4-12.
@LRM5195 Says:
Jason Dunn is the better Hawk Nelson singer. I’m sorry but this guy was the one pushing the band to be a generic pop act.
@darkeyeze Says:
So if I cannot trust my own thinking and I should trust god, which god should I trust? Which faction of which god should I trust.
@akoskormendi9711 Says:
You begin by thinking. Frank and other apologists always do this and it just doesn't make sense. Our thinking being trustworthy is simply axiomatic. You begin with that Frank. Otherwise you wouldn't be able to reason God exists. You trust your thinking by default. You have no other choice, except absurdity.
And in my worldview it makes sense that my thinking is trustworthy, since it was designed by a process that selects for survival, and coming to incorrect conclusions will certainly lead us to death in the wild most often than not. My worldview actually explains human thinking better, because it is often faulty, which is weird if a perfect God designed it, yet makes perfect sense since Evolution makes good enough work, not perfect. The fact that apologists exist prove human thinking is imperfect with how many fallacies they commit when trying to reason.
@bcg3166 Says:
Galatians 4:22 it's written, just because something is written doesn't make it true.
Galatians 4:24, Which things are an (allegory)....All biblical charaters are made up.
1 Hagar- bondmaid.
2 Sarah- freewoman.
Abraham a Hebrew who had sex with an Egyptian and who gave birth to a Ar·ab?
"Coming to the realization that Christ is a consciousness attained by living like Christ and not some guy that lived 2000 years ago was the biggest blessing I have ever received".
Description:
Jesus Christ Never Existed
The beginnings of Christian history were almost nothing like the picture propagated by the priesthood. Christianity actually began as an amalgamation of many ancient beliefs and originally branched off from Gnosticism. Gnosticism was and is a school of religious existentialism that seeks intuitive understanding of God through attaining Gnosis, or “knowledge of the Divine within.”
Constantine publicly outlawed Gnosticism in 325AD and since then the Brotherhood has privately kept its secrets only for the initiated few. In Freemasonry, Gnosticism is the third “G” after God and Geometry represented by their symbolic “G” within the compass/square.
The Gnostics claimed to be the original Christians and they were fervently anti-material, believing in “Christ Consciousness” and the Kingdom of God within. The Gnostics focused on attaining “gnosis” or spiritual knowledge. They refuted claims of blasphemy from the orthodoxy, stating they were the blasphemers. They said the orthodoxy did “not know who Christ is” and read the Bible, especially Genesis too literally, missing the deeper meaning. Orthodox Christians insisted that Jesus Christ was an historical personage who came in the flesh, had 12 apostles, performed miracles, died on the cross, and was resurrected. The Gnostics insisted that their Christ could never take human form.
“Christianity began as Gnosticism, refaced with falsehoods concerning a series of facts alleged to have been historical, but which are demonstrably mythical. By which I do not mean mythical as exaggerations or perversions of historic truth, but belonging to the pre-existant Mythos … It is obvious that the Roman Church remained Gnostic at the beginning of the second century, and for some time afterwards. Marcion, the great Gnostic, did not separate from it until about the year 136 A.D. Tatian did not break with it until long after that. In each case the cause of quarrel was the same. They left the Church that was setting up the fraud of Historic Christianity.” -Gerald Massey, “Gnostic and Historic Christianity”
“So Gnosticism was around long before so-called Orthodox Christianity. The conspirators used the word ‘Docetism’ to refer to those who refused to believe in the incarnation of Jesus. The earliest Gnostic-Christians were not even aware of claims that the Christ incarnated in Jesus.” -Acharya S., “The Christ Conspiracy” (48)
Unbeknownst to the Gnostics, so-called Orthodox Christians like Pliny, the Roman Piso family and others began to propagate the idea that Jesus Christ was a real person. Soon under Roman law the greatest heresy became the unacceptance of Jesus as being a historical figure. Bishop and patriarch of Alexandria, St. Athanasius wrote, “should we understand sacred writ according to the letter, we should fall into the most enormous blasphemies.” In other words, it is a most enormous sin to read the Bible literally!
@regstoy Says:
Do you idiots think, that because we are Atheists, we keep getting short changed at the bar, because we drank two beers and can't figure out how much change we should get from a 20.
How as christians can you reconcile, that some of you think, firstly that noah built a boat and kept all living life on it, and even more scarily, that some of you think that the Earth, is only 6000 years old, yet we're supposed to be the ones who can't trust our own thoughts 😂
@TruthNBible Says:
Atheists can not prove the Bible to be false or God doesn’t exist. If they could then like Sasquatch, God would be gone. Instead God and His Word have endured, while Marxist and atheists and theories have all vanished. Every living human knows God exists. They lie and learn from others how to act confident in their denial, but inside they are weak and timid because they’ve chosen to deny God, even while knowing He exists. DNA and fingerprints are the sign of intelligence, not evolutionary Big Bang chaos. Out!
@isusjeputiistinaizivototkr6134 Says:
It would be great to hear discussion between you and Sabine Hossenfelder. I just finished watching her conversation with
Dr Brian Keating ( YT ) Sabine Hossenfelder | Existential Physics.
@ecargetoled Says:
His words show how his reasonings for not believing in God is the solely emotional and materialistic point of view. That’s a hopeless and pointless endeavor…he never had Faith in God in the first place.
@morlewen7218 Says:
If supernatural beings existed how could you know that your thoughts are your thoughts and further more true. How could you trust your own thinking? Who makes you think what you think? You or a supernatural being?
@Godsglory777 Says:
Great video...but I still hold to the fact that most unbelievers are not turned off by the concept of God because of the lack of evidence (even though most of them make that claim) I believe it's still more about emotion rather than intellect. It's less about evidence and more about they simply just don't like the God of the Bible or even the idea of God at all. Like a criminal not wanting the law or a judge to exist.
@jozuzl1 Says:
I wonder what’s his take on Jesus is now. Does he feel like he was just a guy or does he not believe he existed at all?
@jayyrod1 Says:
If your faith is true, to the Living God, it can not be lost. For he leaves the 99 to come for the one sheep. Therefore, if your faith becomes lost it was never with the Living God to begin with and that's O.K! It just means you've been deceived. If you can recognize that, you can still be saved. Don't throw away your salvation because of your misconception of the gospel for we deceive our selves more often than others deceive us. Hope this helps
@s3tione Says:
If one cannot trust their own thinking and this cannot be an atheist because of that, then one cannot trust any similar thinking on becoming a Christian, Muslim or any such belief.
For what it's worth, I am not sure humans are able to interpret reality as it is.
@larrywilliams5490 Says:
Two Words. COMMON SENSE.😏
@TwistedJedi2288 Says:
That comment from C.S Lewis made perfect sense. How he didn't understand amazes me. Athiest tend to pretend like they don't understand basic comments because it would ruin their ideals.
@dustinpoche5664 Says:
Religion is just used by governments to keep its people ignorant and easy inslave
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