Dr. Jordan B. Peterson and Senator Mike Lee discuss the ever present conflict between Ukraine and Russia, the role of the United States in that conflict via proxy war, the rise of ESG investing, why the top investment firms do not care about your values, and what Senator Lee plans to do about it.
Elected in 2010 as Utah's 16th Senator, Mike Lee has spent his career defending the fundamental liberties of all Americans and advocating for America's founding constitutional principles. Senator Lee acquired a deep respect for the Constitution early in life while watching his father, Rex E. Lee, serve as the Solicitor General under President Ronald Reagan. He attended most of his father's arguments before the U.S. Supreme Court, giving him a unique and up-close understanding of our government. Lee graduated from Brigham Young University with a degree in Political Science, and served as BYU's Student Body President in his senior year. Senator Lee serves as the Ranking Republican on the Judiciary Subcommittee on Antitrust, Competition Policy, and Consumer Rights, in addition to serving on the Energy and Natural Resources Subcommittee on Public Lands, Forests, and Mining and the Committee on the Budget.
Dr. Peterson's extensive catalog is available now on DailyWire+: https://bit.ly/3KrWbS8
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For Senator Mike Lee:
Senator Lee's website: https://www.lee.senate.gov/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/SenMikeLee?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor
Saving Nine (NEW Book): https://www.amazon.com/Saving-Nine-Against-Audacious-American/dp/1546002200
- Chapters -
(0:00) Coming up
(1:46) Intro
(2:37) What is the West aiming at?
(4:12) The reasonable case for war
(6:25) The US perspective
(9:54) Over 100 billion
(11:30) Collusion and a lack of oversight
(14:58) We are basically at war
(16:22) Who are the recipients of our money?
(18:10) Are NATO countries at risk?
(22:44) Governance by single pixel tweet
(25:50) Caught in the bandsaw
(29:35) Why aren't we negotiating for peace?
(32:11) The story Americans are told
(36:39) Fentanyl and other pressing issues on the Homefront
(37:55) Biden and the Red Stage
(40:14) Why speak up on Russia?
(41:35) Is this a Republican issue?
(44:37) Wars are used by governments to consolidate power
(47:55) If Trump were president right now…
(48:48) Desantis and needed skepticism
(49:35) The need for a concrete plan
(52:35) Ukraine wants to take back Crimea
(54:26) The meaning of the Third Commandment
(58:55) Eternal truths and undeserved virtue
(1:03:10) Social credit: the future of monetized virtue
(1:04:55) The problems we collapse into a singularity
(1:07:10) ESG's and gaming the system
(1:08:05) A resolution of disapproval
(1:09:54) The lies of Vanguard and Blackrock
(1:14:59) China and the free market
(1:18:23) On a collision course with reality
(1:21:15) ESG discussion will be a major campaign point
(1:22:34) Vivek Ramaswamy: fighting back
(1:24:07) The American people will not take this
(1:25:32) Senator Lee's priorities
(1:28:20) Decentralizing power
(1:30:55) Responsibility and hierarchy
(1:34:15) Finding happiness in one's work
(1:36:18) Brooding omnipresence
(1:37:09) Joy comes from advancing towards a goal
(1:39:31) Feeling the distance
(1:41:55) Closing remarks
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Most of Dr. Peterson's talks and guests are so good... but this guy's so full of misinformation that I don't even know where to start. And while Dr. Peterson does admit he 'doesn't understand Ukraine', he also doesn't seem to have done any basic research on it at all, because he -really- doesn't understand Ukraine, based on what he's said here.
@wendellbabin6457 Says:
1:03:41 How us this any different from buying "indulgences" in Medieval Catholicism that Protestants are still thymping their Bibles and clutching their Pearls over when the TV cameras are off.?
@regather59 Says:
They seem to've totally glossed over the fact that the bulk of the money assigned is spent in the US on upgrading kit so that old kit, that could do with being upgraded anyway, can be passed on to Ukraine. So yes there'll be some amount of corruption but we're helping a people who historically know the extreme danger of falling once again under the Russian yoke. Jordan could benefit from listening to Jake Broe, or spending some time in war-torn Ukraine, as Lex Fridman did. Why the hell should the Ukrainians seek peace, they want their neighbour bully out, that'll do it.
@manyinterests1961 Says:
1 year later...
@TK-yj1gm Says:
What benefits are we getting in return?
@oleksandradmytruk Says:
Professor Peterson, have you ever considered talking to an actual Ukrainian person? Or do you prefer to stay above all of this dirty war stuff and look down on us from the height of your moral superiority?
@83licata Says:
Since, Crimea was never under Ukraine's rule/leadership; that statement that President Zelensky said was utterly preposterous! After all prior to 2014 when Crimea and Russia came to a mutual agreement, which you can read online, because they weren't annexed; Crimea was a separate country since the fall of the USSR.
Great show, I really enjoyed listening to it!
@soulmane5656 Says:
Medieval moron speaks his brains out loud
@carlinesloup Says:
So Putin is "a bad person" according to Lee. Compared with whom? The Bushes (senior and junior)? Biden? Obama? Netanyahu?
On what evidence? Simply because he finally got round to doing what he should have done years before - take effective steps to protect the Russian-speaking population of Ukraine from horrendous abuse, obscene torture, starvation and mass murder by the Ukrainian army and the neo-fascist battalions?
The "West" (US, UK, EU especially) was turning a blind eye to (and even supporting) these atrocities in pursuit of its longing to put nuclear weapons on the border with Russia - in breach of its own promise never to do such a thing. Does anyone seriously believe that it's ok for 'the West' to do this on the ludicrous grounds that "we are democrats and Russia is a dictatorship" (a complete nonsense in any case). The West's obsession with Russia is absolutely not out of a concern for Russians' democratic rights. It's because the West cannot cope with the idea/reality that the baton of history is now passing to Russia and China ... and breaking up Russia and stealing its rich resources would extend the West's dominance for a few decades or more ... and potentially bring it into a direct confrontation with China.
"Putin is a bad person" is the kind of remark one might expect from a 5-year old. But maybe that is the mental age of the average US representative.
@svitlanapogrebna987 Says:
As Ukrainian I am really frustrated about such understanding of russia-Ukraine war. We did have Minsk peace agreements with russia and there is not any chance that putin complies with any agreement and won't invade in the nearest future again. The victory for Ukraine is to libarate our territory and have the working security guaranties and rather than invading russia territory according to the international law. As a realest I can think of a scenario that Ukraine won't be able to liberate all the territory soon. But definitely if USA would want we can liberate the Crimea with long range missiles that's a feasible task from a military point of view because of the geography and much easier than liberating the east. But it seems that USA doesn't want us to liberate Crimea or want the frog be boiled slowly with the price of Ukrainian lifes. When you count your money and repeat "corruption" all the time you don't say how much advertising Ukraine soldiers have done for USA weapons systems. The Patriot and Himars systems are number one weapons because they showed great success in the arms if Ukrainians. The USA forced Ukraine to refuse from nuclear and strategic weapons and did not react on invading our territory in 2014. I do understand that the war began due to the Putin idea to reunion the imperia. On Ukraine side our politics ruined our military since 1991 till 2014. But the West did not comply with the Budapest memorandum that guarantees our sovereignty and territorial integrity saying it does make any legal force. I am smiling each time when I hear that Russia can be an ally with the West against China. russia is an asian county on the most of its territory, russian have the same ideology as Chinese of fully controlling their people. russia does have the communist hearitage and glorifies its. Ukrainian want to go after the communism hearitage to build the democracy and does not want to join russia to be recruted for the future russia-moldova or russia-baltic states wars. The referendum idea is terrible. Russia displaced the half citizens of Crimea with their people. And you suggest to conduct the referendum on the territory occupied by the military forces against the international law. Seriously??? If you regret to support Ukraine then imagine a situation when russia wins and mobilizes Ukrainians from fully or partially controlled Ukraine to invade far to the NATO borders. You are completely wrong when you think it is enough to give up on russian speaking territories in order to satisfy russia as the West gave up on Czech Republic in 1938 in favor of nazi Germany. Ukraine will be the most rusofob country in the world for the next 50 years because of what they have done to us. So tight culture integrity between Ukraine and russia is going away and not relevant any more. It is the same if you tell to the Sourth Koreabs that they should give some territory to the North Koreans in order to prevent a nuke strike from the north because they have strong ties and speak the same language. I can imagine that it is a possible scenario nowadays after the Israel-Hamas war started.
@JennyIpray Says:
Thank you. From St-Petersburg Russia
@vladyslavmyrhorod9987 Says:
Please talk about psychology not about politics and Ukraine… How many years you lived in Ukraine or at least how many times you at least visited Ukraine? You just repeat Russian propaganda! If you want to understand Ukraine more at least visit it and talk to people, learn history talk to Timothy D. Snyder
@curious_am Says:
@Jordan B Peterson my 1st reaction to this video was that you are an educated idiot (I am using this word because you are using it towards others so I assume you are comfortable with it and don't take this as an offence). But I see distinct trend in your narrative. And it boils down to 1 thing "f@ck the others - Jordan B Peterson wants to live at their expense". So you are not an idiot. You are a parasite. I am sure you will get what all parasites eventually get.
@ulasparks1538 Says:
I have observed Jordan Peterson for a number of years now and I feel that he is just wrecked by fear, anxiety, total self-control, suppressed anger, the sense of duty, and his ideas are a direct result of this emotional condition.
It is painful to watch how bitter and constraint he is. I prefer to listen to Gabor Maté instead, who has undergone some deep emotional healing and speakes from a deeper place.
@JohnDBarcaFan Says:
How come no one mentions that US, Britian and Russia all promised to protect Ukraine’s border when it gave up all of its nuclear power in 91…
Also, if he thinks Ukraine is corrupt at hence - they should not exist, he probably should look into Russia…
I have an immense respect to Dr. Peterson, but I cannot disagree more with him on this topic.
@Paganwolf420 Says:
Mr. Peterson, an international fascist Oligarchy has us by the balls.
@vasilena85 Says:
You speculate too much:) Everyone saw how "strong" is the "Bear". And the nuke argument is not an argument - it's like scaring people away with a sign Bad(evil) Dog. They know they can't use the nukes otherwise they will not have anything standing on water. And the war can potentially end for less than a week if NATO goes to Ukraine because of that. Plus what? Russia is 1 country and it's not the only one that has nukes. But we also know that it's not necessary to respond with nukes to nukes. No one wants such Apocalypse and I really hope that the crazy Nazi in Russia that calls himself a "president" will be eliminated before this ever happens. Peaceful talks can be initiated only if Russia leaves Ukraine land. This is step 1. Russia is the one that don't want peace. Peace and no resolution and then what? Few more years from now and Russia will be back on its feet with more weapons for destruction and then here we go again. And it's not a speculation that Russia wants to expand to other countries as well. I live in Bulgaria and I can feel the real thread. Russia rooted some deep influence in out government during the last 60-70 years and it's really hard to undo the disastrous influence and bad decisions that were took during these years and even now. And the fact that a lot of Russians have land and properties across the Black Sea coast and the fact that Russia even speculates with that in their mainstream media and not just simple joke tv hosts but actually official Duma ministers were commenting on that. And the history know how Russia had always appetite for our land and Black Sea to be close Sea owned by Russia.
We all know what happened with Georgia. And many other countries around Russia. We all know for fact that Donbas shit show and Crimea was staged by Russia and how we can stay silent and blind? 21st century and shameful war in Europe? What country wants expansion in 21st century? The truth is that NATO had to enter Ukraine as "no ones land" and stay there as guarant. Russia has exactly the same right to be there, as NATO. But they are all chickens. And that's why now people die and money are spent like a "drunken sailor", as you said.
@MrBrownstone8881 Says:
War, what is it good for... absolute corruption.
@laurnecius Says:
The sole reason I wanted to watch this interview is because I thought before hand: I don't think I'm going to agree with the statements that are going to be made here.
Those are the moments I like the most, since I do agree and understand a lot of JP's wisdom, but I don't want to see him as the ultimate source of truth. Wise as he may be, he can be wrong sometimes as he is only human too. That is why I love it when I disagree with something he states because it helps me keep my critical thinking sharp.
BTW, I still don't agree with all his points here or the points of the senator, but it did cause me to raise some questions in my mind on how I feel about this conflict. And I feel that indeed, pouring endless money and material into a pit hoping good will magically appear out from it is not very smart. As well as this, even if a situation seems black and white it never really is and your should always be able to debate the gray area.
@IvanKolupaeff Says:
Dear Mr. Jordan. I'm Russian. I left from my country 5 years ago. Yes, it's reasonable to assume that Russia presents a credible threat to integrity of the NATO alliance and the West outside the specific case of Ukraine. Keeping strong Russia and not helping Ukraine would end up in such a disaster in comparison to which Nazi's Germany would seem to be a peacemaker.
So, the goal is to weaken Russia and to help democratic forces in Russia or even make Russia split into pieces. Yes, it's challenging future. But it's the only future (hope to be wrong) which might give hope to this world.
Did you ever see Pugachiov's interview about Putin?
@RinatSeksembai Says:
Privet Freunde, da ich nur engl verstehe und nicht spreche schreibe ich euch auf deutsch (gleiche Sprachgruppe, russisch könnt ihr ja nicht) habe mich mit Geschichte auseinandersetzen müssen um jeden den Mund zu stopfen zu können wenn man mich wieder mal als "Scheiß Russen" bezeichnet und alles böse den Russen anhängen will. Als erstes 85% der Wehrmacht hat die Rote Armee (РККА) zerschlagen, für euch EIGHTYFIVE % of the Wehrmacht have destroyd the RED ARMY: Als zweites Napoleon hat nicht Wellington oder Nelson besiegt sondern Zar Alexander der Erste, der Alexanderplatz in Berlin wurde nach ihm benannt und selbst "падонок Елёйзевич" (googeln) hat es nicht gewagt ihn umzubennenen.
UND JETZT ZU EUCH VESPUCCI'S, wenn ihr nicht einwenig eure grauen Zellen einschaltet und zur VERNUNFT kommt dann wird ein Platz in Washington D.C. "PUTIN Place" heißen. Wollt ihr das? PS : alter, Geographie solltet ihr mal lernen in euren Schulen, wenn ich mir ansehe wie ungebildet ihr seit dafür müsst ihr euch schämen, ich habe in der DDR POS (Politechnische Oberschule) lernen dürfen und wenn ich sehe wie ihr euch jedes mal bei irgetwelchen Straßenumfragen lächerlich macht tut mir das innerlich weh. Entweder sind eure Lehrer SCHEIßE oder ihr lernt nichts in der Schule aus ARROGANZ. Geht zu den Amisch, die haben da mehr Ahnung! ach SLAWA TEXAS!
@DJ-JUDGE Says:
Amazing to see how many people are disillusioned to what's happening in this world and stick to their narrative of moral posturing and right fighting for Ukraine and the West, my goodness its pathetic.
@josephkuser3998 Says:
I like Mike Lee but those reforms to stop the executive from making law won't work.
The executive branch at this point has 3 letter agencies that are loyal to it not their oath to the constitution. They make law themselves and although the Supreme Court has ruled what they're doing illegal they continue to do it. The same will happen with the executive. There's no teeth! The people are the only ones accountable to the law at this point.
Good luck though.
@darthcaedus5124 Says:
So is your deal for peace to give Russia everything it’s taken?
@sssharkslim487 Says:
This senator is saying a piece of s**t
@MajkelPCLabpl Says:
My God, this is sow shallow talk. Basically you touchbased on ALL false arguments shared by russian propaganda and almost NONE rational arguments allies has against unjustful, barbaric invasion to a neighbouring country. I just want to believe it was not intentional by you. Please invite someone closer to this case who will easily guide you through all missed things - I can recommend former Polish MFA - Radek Sikorski or former Finnish president Sauli Niinisto. There is so much of these missed things that I won't even start listing those in a comment. It needs to be a vid.
@MrMantosius Says:
A russian loss would like restoring ukraine boarders, russia paying reparatorions to restore ukraine, war criminals are in jail, rusia federation is de-federated, denacionalised and demilitirised - thats what would be considered victory, hope this clarifies, Br, Lithuania
@perun814 Says:
russian historic mission was to defend all of us east Europeans.Get it.
who gave u that mission America?
@perun814 Says:
if putin goes away nothing changes the situation.
look...elon musk wants to go into space....he needs russia
putin is the problem...according to that logic
@perun814 Says:
and yes i do know about the plan of creating a western Russian nation(roughly the inhabitants of the original KIEVan rus state
the theory is that a russian state roughly half the size of current russia will weaken rusaia but it wont weaken it to much
@perun814 Says:
the American foreign policy for 100 years has been weaken germany and Russia and stop their domination of the European continent..
military bases in ukraine is absolutely impossible...most of ulranians are technically speaking ethnic Russianz
@perun814 Says:
you do alzo know that the mekender thesis is 100% guarantee for thermonuclear war.
there is no such thing as the
west.There is no western identity...nada
@perun814 Says:
nazi megalomania a
soviet gigantomania
@c.cryder8398 Says:
Concerning Academia. It's a dance with words. Became relevant with Russel Brandt.
@MegaKimor Says:
It's so interesting that Jordan, always talking about getting to the truth haven't even tried in this particular direction
@denisharding5606 Says:
I disagree with Mr Lee when he says that the West has driven Russia and China together. Their political systems have been dictatorships with very limited compassion for human rights for decades. They both want to control other countries, eg the Ukrnian invasion and Chinas Belt & Road iniative to make many countires economically dependant on China.
If the West does not continue to support Ukraine until Russia has left all its lands, Russia, suppoted by China and their allies, will continue for decades to try to subugate other currently independant countries to "beat" the west. They will do this economically and militarily.
@michalveltrusky9633 Says:
I have come to watch your podcast after a long time, since the ''Civil war'' episode, and I am upset and saddened that you are still deadly wrong when it comes to Ukraine (especially the 'ŕeasonable case for war''part is like it came straight from Russia Today ), which is much more ironic when I consider what you have said and wrote about the collective West and Russia( = Soviet Union) over the years
, also it seems like you are so unwilling to be on the same side as J.Trudeau,i.e. the West, that you rather be against it.
Please consider having Prof. Timothy Snyder on your podcast.
@IngMarinoiuMarian Says:
You become the joke of the internet...Russia pays you well? So shameful, from a mentor to a clown.
@olyakozlova9200 Says:
may be Peterson can come and visit Ukraine and see for himself what are fighting against and what are standing up for here....
@elisakozlowsky5469 Says:
So, Zelensky never wanted peace. Did he say that Ukranian tanks will occupy Moscow? Really?? This is freaking scary and maniac. The conflic is much worse now than in the beggining. We know too little about European East. Zelensky could have urged people to flee (the frontiers were open, many have fled) and he could have fled too. And leave Crimea to Russia. Idk, not a glorious decision, but he would have avoided this Russia/China/North-Korea brothers-in-arms love story.
@amyandrone8127 Says:
I’m starting to believe that Putin is not the bad guy. Ukraine has and still is a VERY corrupt country. People really need to do some research.
@peterrowe6055 Says:
Russia will never give up the Crimea. You would have to be delusional to think that Putin would ever agree to the port of Sevastopol becoming a port for US Navy and NATO warships.
@peterrowe6055 Says:
If the war is a battle between good and evil, the woke progressive western politicos, institutions and corporations are the fifth columnists for the globalists who are the poster children for authoritarianism and the deviant, immoral and evil elements of society.
@ashvandal5697 Says:
This is absolutely the conversation I wish I could be present for.
@ashvandal5697 Says:
I love love listening to the hand-wringing of penny-counting during a war effort by the minority parties. We literally paid the Taliban to not attack us in Afghanistan, similar efforts in Iraq, but we’re concerned Ukraine may be misappropriating some war funds.
Ok.
@sarchisi Says:
Please let us know how Putin has been bad for the west. How is Putin the bad guy and our leaders the good guys after the world witnessed the devastated middle east resulting in mass migration, death and destruction going on for over 2 decades. Not to mention the overthrow of governments.
Now please explain how Putin is the bad guy when he has highest approval rating that any western leader I could remember.
@imaginaryspace106 Says:
9:00 and Russia isn't support North Korea?
@janosik6761 Says:
"Russia and Ukraine have been tight together for the entire history of both countries" - Jordan Peterson, you need to educate yourself better mate.
@Sorrowblast Says:
Putin is a bad person and leader? Compared to who? To Biden? To Trudeau? To Macron? To Scholz?
Why is he bad? Because he’s not a pawn, but pwns the whole collective west?
@timjones1583 Says:
Both these men are ignorant to NATO in this conversation.
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